Subject: YTSEJAM digest 261
From: email_address_removed
To: Multiple recipients of list <email_address_removed>

Contents:
Re: Gibraltar maling list? (email_address_removed.nl (Erwin Gavic))
Pendragon (email_address_removed.nl (Erwin Gavic))
Re: YTSEJAM digest 256 (email_address_removed (Steve Mansfield))
Re: DT single cd!!! (email_address_removed (Steve Mansfield))
Re: James LaBrie -- Shy, or just an @$$hole? (email_address_removed (Steve Mansfield))
Fates Warning (email_address_removed (The J-Man))
 (email_address_removed.ac.uk)
to live forever (hartman larry <email_address_removed>)
Re: YTSEJAM digest 260 (Stephen Bajzek <[email-masked]>)
Re: YTSEJAM digest 256 (email_address_removed (DAVID RE))
Re: Interesting Things (email_address_removed (DAVID RE))
Re: Kings X vs DT (email_address_removed (DAVID RE))
Re: Stuff (DEAN'S CUP COMMITTEE REPRESENTATIVE <email_address_removed>)
Re: James Labrie...hmmmph!!! (email_address_removed (DAVID RE))
PMU Hamlet connection (Michael Burstin <email_address_removed>)
Re: re:YTSEJAM digest 254 (email_address_removed (DAVID RE))
Re: YTSEJAM digest 260 (email_address_removed (Michael A. Daugherty))
 fw:YTSEJAM digest 42  ("oliver (o.r.) sampson" <[email-masked]>)

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Mon, 06 Dec 1993 09:43:50 +0100 (MET)
From: email_address_removed.nl (Erwin Gavic)
Subject: Re: Gibraltar maling list?

| 
| Sorry to bother everyone but I've been trying to subscribe to the 
| "Gibraltar" mailing list but my message never gets through 
| (email_address_removed).  I got this address from 
| email_address_removed (Musical list of lists).  Has anyone else subscribed?
| Thanks.
I think you've got the wrong address. It's  email_address_removed
I sent my request to thiss address too, and I got subscribed to it.

Hope this will help you.

Greetings,

:=:-:=:-:=:-:=:-:=:-:=:-:=:-:=:-:=:-:=:-:=:-:=:-:=:-:=:-:=:-:=:
:   Erwin Gavic         E-Mail : email_address_removed.nl      :
:                       FidoNet: 2:512/49                     :
:                                                             :
:  "Tell me I'm mad, how should I know?"                      :
:                       -- Marillion (GoodBye To All That)    :
:=:-:=:-:=:-:=:-:=:-:=:-:=:-:=:-:=:-:=:-:=:-:=:-:=:-:=:-:=:-:=:

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 06 Dec 1993 09:49:35 +0100 (MET)
From: email_address_removed.nl (Erwin Gavic)
Subject: Pendragon

Hello everybody.

I'm sorry for this mesg, because it's not about the band, but
is there somebody who is subscribed to the Pendragon fanclub "The Mob"??

If so, could you please E-mail me to my address???

In advance, thanks a lot!

:=:-:=:-:=:-:=:-:=:-:=:-:=:-:=:-:=:-:=:-:=:-:=:-:=:-:=:-:=:-:=:
:   Erwin Gavic         E-Mail : email_address_removed.nl      :
:                       FidoNet: 2:512/49                     :
:                                                             :
:  "Tell me I'm mad, how should I know?"                      :
:                       -- Marillion (GoodBye To All That)    :
:=:-:=:-:=:-:=:-:=:-:=:-:=:-:=:-:=:-:=:-:=:-:=:-:=:-:=:-:=:-:=:

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 6 Dec 1993 06:58:16 -0500 (EST)
From: email_address_removed (Steve Mansfield)
Subject: Re: YTSEJAM digest 256

> > Also in Status Seeker somewhere, and Surrounded, and a couple of other songs
> > I have noticed a couple of relgious statements.  I know Charles wore a cross
> > and I believe Keven Moore does as well.  It doesn't bother me if they are
> > religous or aren't.  Do any of you pick up on this?
> 
> 	I too am curious and I picked up on this. The spoiler is the Pull
> Me Under video where a guy crucifies himself. This could be meant as a
> slap in the face of Christianity or it could be a reinforcement of same.
Or it could be something completely obscure, made up by the label without
consulting the band.  Quote from Mike:  "What the hell *was* that bondage
wolfman shit?!?!"

> On the plus side, their shirts, the LATM and LIT covers, and part of the
> IAW cover all feature the Sacred Heart of Jesus...in flames, and I have
> seen it that way in religious icons. 
> 
> 	I'm not some Bible thumper, just a guy going to college like most
> of you and I do still follow my religion when I get a chance... and a lot
> of what Dream Theater says is in NO CONFLICT with that... hehe "Find all
> you need inyour mind if you take the time" whoa real satanic there. :)

Kevin is probably the most religious of the band.  Most of the religious
references are in his songs.  The sacred heart idea was his.

Steve Mansfield  | Once you're touched you stand alone to face the bitter fight
email_address_removed | Once I reached for love but now I reach for life.
Dream Theater - Learning to Live

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 6 Dec 1993 07:22:11 -0500 (EST)
From: email_address_removed (Steve Mansfield)
Subject: Re: DT single cd!!!

> > I just read the latest discography in the last digest and I was wondering
> > if anyone really knows what Eve is.  One part said that it was the begging
> > of Take the Time and one said it was the opening of Pull Me Under.
> 
> 	Well, I'm afraid all I can do is make an educated guess on this
> one, but based on the submitted material for the discog, I would say Eve
> is a 1 1/2 minute instrumental that is slow, hard, with "crunch" guitars
> by Petrucci and high-end lick by Moore. If you have the Live in Tokyo
> video, it's right before Take The Time. 

Buzzzz.  But thank you for playing.  It's on Live at the Marquee.  The noe
you heard on Live in Tokyo is, I believe, Bombay Vindaloo.  That, or it's
just a miscellaneous instrumental they tacked onto the beginning of Take
The Time.  Eve is much softer and melodic, with lots of vocal samples
thrown in.

Steve Mansfield  | Once you're touched you stand alone to face the bitter fight
email_address_removed | Once I reached for love but now I reach for life.
Dream Theater - Learning to Live

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 6 Dec 1993 07:52:55 -0500 (EST)
From: email_address_removed (Steve Mansfield)
Subject: Re: James LaBrie -- Shy, or just an @$$hole?

> I caught the following DT gigs during the Images and Tour tour that were
> relatively close to one another:
> 
> 	     Dream Theater 1992-1993 "Images & Tour" Concert Dates
> 
> Month	Day	City, State (Country)	Venue
> -----------------------------------------------------------------------------
> 
> *** 1992:
> 
> Dec 	16	Boston, MA		Axis
> 
> *** 1993:
> 
> Jan 	09	Salisbury, MA		Chapter II
> Jan 	10	Hadley, MA		Vertex
> Jan 	13	Providence, RI		Club Babyhead
> 
> 
> Each time, I was in the front row for the shows!!  By the time the Babyhead gig
> rolled around, James would look at me like "I'm sick of seeing you at our f'ing
> gigs...why don't you stop coming?" ... or something like that.  A real loser, if
> you ask me (the Yngwie Malmsteen attitude!).  

Well, in the 11 shows of thirs I've been to (Would've been 12 if I hadn't
dropped the f**king master link on my motorcycle driving to Denver...), and
he's been really snotty sometimes, nonexistant sometimes, to reasnably
sociable at times.  I've watched his face pretty closeely, and James just
doesn't seem to make eye cnotact with the audience very well.  He'll look
at you for a moment, and then look back up into the lights.  If you watch
closeely, that's where he spends most of his time watching, rather than the
audience.  I seriously don't think it's an attitude, so much as not having
adjusted to dealing with fans yet.  DT's been around doing this for 7 years
now.  James has actually been with a successful band now for just over 2.
Give him time.  I've had more trouble talking with Kevin than I have with
James, but mainly because Kevin just tends to be more private than John P.
and Mike.

Steve Mansfield  | Once you're touched you stand alone to face the bitter fight
email_address_removed | Once I reached for love but now I reach for life.
Dream Theater - Learning to Live

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 6 Dec 1993 08:56:42 +119304128 (EST)
From: email_address_removed (The J-Man)
Subject: Fates Warning

Hi All,

After seeing about five people post stuff about Fates Warning I decided to 
post something that you might all find interesting.  Well I don't know if
any of you have heard about something called CDC buy it is a place where
you can telnet to and order CD's.  Last time I checked (yesterday) they
had in there catalog Night on Broken, the Spectre Within and I think Awaken
the Guardian.  You might ask how do i get to this thing?  Well you want to
telnet holonet.net and login as cdc.  If it doesn't go through the first time
try later, it gets very busy sometimes.  On CDC one can use a credit card or
send a check.  I have gotten one order from them so far and I have been
very satisfyied with there service and speed of delivery.  So I hope this
helps all you FW fans out there.

Also whoever said they would want to trade DT boots for the promo CD could
you please write to me.  I have been looking for any DT boots for the longest
time now.  Also if anyone wants to sell there boots or maybe make a good taped
copy of them for me please e-mail me and we can work something out.

-Jason

+-----------------------------------------------------------------------------+
|                                                                             |
| Jason T. Breitweg (J-Man)         In the distance I saw a woman             |
|                                   Dressed in black with eyes of grey        |
| email_address_removed        She wore her pain like a shackled spirit  |
| email_address_removed        Eternal life was her debt to pay          |
| email_address_removed                    - "The Lady Wore Black"  |
| email_address_removed                         Queensryche           |
|                                                                             |
+-----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 06 Dec 93 13:31:50 GMT
From: email_address_removed.ac.uk
Subject: 

Hi,

  Various people put forward intepretations of Pull Me Under & Take The
Time.  Again, I'll quote from the interview I did with Mike last April:

PM:  Another question,  which is about Pull Me Under.  There
     seem to  be a lot of references in there to Hamlet.  Is
     that genuine?  Is the song about Hamlet?

Mike:  Yeah.  That's Kev also.  Those are Kev's lyrics.  And
     in his  words, it's  not  a  song  about  Hamlet,  it's
     inspired by  Hamlet, and it's taking the story...  What
     Kev says is that it's not a song about Hamlet, but it's
     a song  about what  Hamlet is  about.  There's a lot of
     direct references in there, but it's basically relaying
     the story  of  somebody  coping  with  somebody  else's
     death, and  trying to  deal with it, and avenge it, and
     trying to  face the situation.  And in the case of Pull
     Me  Under,  it's  almost  pessimistic,  which  is  very
     different from the outlook of the rest of the lyrics on
     the album, which are more optimistic.

PM:   Yes, I  found that.   What's  the significance  of the
     sudden cut-off at the end of that track.  Is that a bad
     edit, or is it deliberate?

Mike:   Actually it's  completely deliberate.   That  was my
     idea.  Everybody, when the album came out, thought that
     their CD  was defective  or something.    Basically  we
     wrote it  like that, it wasn't even a studio technique,
     like we  had an  ending and  we decided  to just cut it
     out.   We wrote  it like that, and the very end of that
     song has  all these  different grooves  chugging along,
     and  then   these  different  vocals,  keyboards  being
     layered on  top, and  then I just said 'Hey, let's just
     drop dead  outta nowhere.   Just go from one extreme to
     the other'.   Basically  it's a  rip off  of the end of
     side one  of Abbey Road (laughs).  The Beatles did that
     20 years ago.  It was just for the effect of it.

--------------

  PM: ...What is Take the Time about...?

Mike:   Well actually  the lyrics  to Take  The Time  were a
     first for  us.   This was  the  first  time  we'd  ever
     written lyrics together.  We decided we wanted to write
     a song  about the  whole period we were going through -
     looking for  a singer,  a label,  and in a sense taking
     the time  to make  these right decisions.  And we broke
     it up,  first verse, second verse, third verse, bridge,
     and chorus,  and everybody  went away - like, I had the
     first verse,  John Myung  had the  second  verse,  John
     Petrucci wrote  the third  verse,  and  Kev  wrote  the
     bridge.   And everybody  went away and wrote from their
     individual points  of view,  their views  on the  whole
     situation we  were going through, and then got together
     & put  it all  together.   So that one line, 'I can see
     much clearer  now I'm  blind' was  Kev's  part  of  the
     lyrics, those  were the  bridge.  And he also mentioned
     something like  that in Surrounded too.  You'll have to
     ask Kev what they mean, though.
------------------

   Paul May, University of Bristol, UK

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 6 Dec 1993 09:06:07 -0500 (EST)
From: hartman larry <email_address_removed>
Subject: to live forever

I know that Mike wrote a Change of Season, but I was wondering who wrote
To Live Forever.  I saw this listed on the Majesty demo tapes, I couldn't 
believe that it was that old.  It sounds really new and fresh.

Also, has anyone ordered any bootleg audio or video tapes from that guy over
in England with that big list of stuff.  He post on here a month or so ago.
How long did it take you to get the stuff?
How much did it cost you to ship from US to UK?
How is the quality of the recording itself and/or the dubbing of it onto tape?

Thanks for the info!

Jason Hartman
"I am the Killing Hand!"

------------------------------

Date: Mon,  6 Dec 1993 09:25:41 -0500 (EST)
From: Stephen Bajzek <[email-masked]>
Subject: Re: YTSEJAM digest 260

Excerpts from mail: 6-Dec-93 YTSEJAM digest 260 by this "Mike" character 
> 
> Anyone here figure out what Take The Time is about? I had no idea (other
> than ambiguous 'it's about not hurrying things and thinking them through')
> until last night I was reading, and it hit me. We have to ask them about
> this.. it's based on J.R.R. Tolkien's The Hobbit/Lord of the Rings! I
> shall expand on this:

I always thought it was about the power of the human mind and the wisdom
of thinking things through. 
> 
> "The unbroken spirit obscured in disquiet" - Tolkien uses those EXACT
> WORDS in the Mirkwood forest while Bilbo is thinking...

If these are the exact words it would make this explanation more plausible.

> 
> "By the spirit this trial demands" - the whole story is Gandalf's sending
> Bilbo on one hell of a trial.. which he passes.
> 
> "And at the end of this day, sighs in anxious relief, for the fortune is
> still in his hands" - the ring of invisibility, even when they keep
> running into trouble, and Sting, his magic sword.
> 
> "You're fighting the weight of the world, no one can save you this time,
> close your eyes, and you'll find all you need in your mind" - Bilbo has to
> save the dwarven party more than once, against seemingly insurmountable
> odds, and he closes his eyes and thinks up a solution and pulls it off,
> saving the party...
> 
> "I close my eyes, and feel the water rise around me" - the enchanted river
> that puts people to sleep if they fall in, like Bombur did!!
> 
> "Drown the beat of time, left my senses fall away" - it also acted as a
> spell of "forget" to any victim, and the last thing they remembered was
> events from weeks ago.
> 
> "Givig freely wandering promises, A place with decisions I'll fashion, I
> won't waste another breath." - again Tolkien practically quotes this when
> the party has just left Beorn and Gandalf...
> 
> What do you all think? I know it's not exactly a modern subject, but the
> quotes fit, or seem to... and shit, if Pull Me Under is about Hamlet, this
> could be anything...

I don't know. The cool thing about a lot of DT's lyrics is, while they
may be about one thing or another, they are ambiguous enough to be
interpreted in many ways, so that each song might mean something to
everyone who hears it on a more personal level. Metropolis, for example,
can be interpreted word for word to be about my life, which is kind of
cool even though I doubt John was thinking of me when he wrote it.
That's also why it was probably wise for the lyrics to LTL not to
broadcast "this song is about AIDS." Most people would not be able to
relate to it very well if it did. This is one of the reasons that John
and Kevin (and John) are probably my favorite lyricists. Almost every
song has something that I can relate to in some way, although at the
same time they rarely come across as telling anyone how to live their
life. 

That said, does anyone know what the FUCK Under a Glass Moon is about?

--max

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 6 Dec 1993 10:11:00 -0500 (EST)
From: email_address_removed (DAVID RE)
Subject: Re: YTSEJAM digest 256

     [stuff about King's X deleted]

> I'm not so sure about "not as heavy"...certainly they don't have anything

     Well, overall, I'd have to agree with the original poster. King's X
isn't all *that* heavy. They certainly have a hard edge on most stuff, and
as you said, there are definately tunes that rock with the heaviest of them,
but they also have that quite, sinister kind of side that I love so much, too :)

> I love Iron Maiden (I've been a fan of them for almost 9 years), but I
> hesitate to desribe Bruce as better than Tate or LaBrie.  Bruce's voice was
> always pretty gruff; sometimes that worked to his advantage, sometimes not.

     Well, to me, an "edge" on someone's voice doesn't change the fact that
they're singing the notes. Also, if you remember back to the earlier days,
before Bruce got old and left his prime (and then his band :) the man used
to belt out not only some *very* high notes, but did them extremely clearly
(ie, no "screeching", etc), and very *powerfully*. The man could support his
voice like nobody's business. Tate doesn't tend to do that, especially live.
Having seen them twice, I guess I can reasonably stand by that. He chops notes
short a lot, doesn't support them at all (at least the higher ones), and seems
to change a lot of notes to lower (sometimes much lower) notes live, where
he had sang things that really all that tough. I would guess that, live, this
is due to an endurance thing. LaBrie doesn't sing all that bad live to me. 
Some parties here don't like it, but... :) I've only heard two cuts from
LatM (the two on the promo disc), but I thought he sang them just fine. 
Especially Surrounded. And, live, I think he's a stronger singer than Tate.
     Mind you, this is just my (probably worthless) opinion :)

> I agree that he did more with the crowd than LaBrie (unfortunately, I've
> never seen Queensryche live, except for their video)...but I always wished
> he'd hold that microphone in the OTHER hand for a while.  :)

     Aww, come on :) I always wanted him to use a wireless, too, but I guess
he needs *somelthing* to play with while he's singing. Sure beats grabbing
his crotch :)

-- 
Dave Re                   |"I am your master, when you're all alone.
OIT/TS/ISD                | You can come to me child, when you're without home.
email_address_removed  | I will share your pain, of long lost dignity.
                          | Happiness evades you, you'll get no sympathy."
                          |       "Father of the Night", Crowdad
         "Heh Heh. I know where there's a dead raccoon!! Heh heh."
                       "FIRE!!!  FIRE!!! FIRE!!!"

 	 "The juggernaut that is Early Warning will CRUSH you!!!!" 

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 6 Dec 1993 10:16:18 -0500 (EST)
From: email_address_removed (DAVID RE)
Subject: Re: Interesting Things

     Well, as a drummer, I have to say......

> 	Well Mike knows his stuff! Peart rules... easily the best drummer alive.

     NOT!!!!!!!!!!!!!

     I'm not trying to start a flame war with Rush fans or anything, so 
don't get your panties in a wad. Just remember that there's a whole lot more
music out there than rock, and I can guaran-damn-tee you that I can name
several guys in the jazz world that can take Peart to school and back.

> 	I thought that if anything... DT as a whole is hard to get to
> meet.. but you may have provn me wrong... after the show in Tempe, I got
> to chat with Galactic Cowboys and they were too cool... but DT just
> left... oh well

     Yeah, the GC guys are pretty cool. I talked with Monty after their show
here, when they opened for Overkill (they *still* haven't come through in
support of "Space" :( ) He's was really laid back. So was Alan, their drummer.
Ben came walking out with his beer to join in. The only one I didn't chat
with for a bit was Dane, as he was sick as hell, and was back in the bus.

-- 
Dave Re                   |"I am your master, when you're all alone.
OIT/TS/ISD                | You can come to me child, when you're without home.
email_address_removed  | I will share your pain, of long lost dignity.
                          | Happiness evades you, you'll get no sympathy."
                          |       "Father of the Night", Crowdad
         "Heh Heh. I know where there's a dead raccoon!! Heh heh."
                       "FIRE!!!  FIRE!!! FIRE!!!"

 	 "The juggernaut that is Early Warning will CRUSH you!!!!" 

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 6 Dec 1993 10:20:46 -0500 (EST)
From: email_address_removed (DAVID RE)
Subject: Re: Kings X vs DT

> NO DOUBLE KICK? I cant remember what its called, but there's a song on
> "faith hope love" (I believe it was an instrumental) had some INCREDIBLY
> fast bass drumming! Are you sure there's no double kick?

     I can support Mike here and say, Nope, no double kick. Jerry uses a single
drum and has a very fast right foot. No double pedal, either. I don't know 
what song you're hearing that had the fast stuff on it, but if you mailed me
with the song title, I could tell you how it's played :)

-- 
Dave Re                   |"I am your master, when you're all alone.
OIT/TS/ISD                | You can come to me child, when you're without home.
email_address_removed  | I will share your pain, of long lost dignity.
                          | Happiness evades you, you'll get no sympathy."
                          |       "Father of the Night", Crowdad
         "Heh Heh. I know where there's a dead raccoon!! Heh heh."
                       "FIRE!!!  FIRE!!! FIRE!!!"

 	 "The juggernaut that is Early Warning will CRUSH you!!!!" 

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 6 Dec 1993 10:28:50 -0500 (EST)
From: DEAN'S CUP COMMITTEE REPRESENTATIVE <email_address_removed>
Subject: Re: Stuff

This goes out to Mike:  I have 2 new editions for your discography.
They are Skyway to nightmares and Live in Long Island. later, Gary

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 6 Dec 1993 10:29:49 -0500 (EST)
From: email_address_removed (DAVID RE)
Subject: Re: James Labrie...hmmmph!!!

> Mike: "I remember you...frontrow center last night in Dallas...right?"
> Me:   "Yep..."
> James:"What? Mike...you actually remember someone in the audience...I try to
> 	look at them as little as I have to" (said in snotty voice)
> 
> Anyway...From now on I will remember James Labrie as the asshole of the band.

     For that comment??? heh. I can say with almost sureity that he was joking.
When I met James, he seemed to me to be kind of aloof, but hyper at the same
time. Those kind of people can come across as assholes occasionally, and 
generally their jokes sound fairly sarcastic, but I've had a fairly long 
conversation with James (like, on the order of 15 or more minutes) and he
seemed to be thrilled that people would even show up to see the band, much 
less being an arrogant asshole. I think you need to re-analize the situation
and give the guy a break.....

> the band, like he was still an outsider.  Maybe that is why he seems to 
> overcompensate by screeching and being a general asshole sometimes.  Maybe as

     Yeah, he feels like an outsider so he screams instead of sings. Sounds
like you have "hurt fan" syndrom. Get over it. You have absolutely no idea
what a band go through while on tour, do you??? Heh. Until you know what
goes on I suggest you remember that everyone is *HUMAN*. They have bad days. 
Also, not everyone is quite as bubbly as Mike P. Next to him, anyone could
be an asshole.......

-- 
Dave Re                   |"I am your master, when you're all alone.
OIT/TS/ISD                | You can come to me child, when you're without home.
email_address_removed  | I will share your pain, of long lost dignity.
                          | Happiness evades you, you'll get no sympathy."
                          |       "Father of the Night", Crowdad
         "Heh Heh. I know where there's a dead raccoon!! Heh heh."
                       "FIRE!!!  FIRE!!! FIRE!!!"

 	 "The juggernaut that is Early Warning will CRUSH you!!!!" 

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 6 Dec 1993 10:31:01 -0500 (EST)
From: Michael Burstin <email_address_removed>
Subject: PMU Hamlet connection

Hello there... here is a copy from last year of the PMU/Hamlet
connection... it is kinda long, but here goes  (BTW, this was not
mine, just someone else on YTSE)

Date: Tue, 6 Apr 1993 05:47:59 -0400 (EDT)
From: email_address_removed (Pete "Ender" Walsh)
Subject: Pull Me Under / Hamlet

  Recent discussion on alt.rock-n-roll.metal.progressive has spawned renewed
interest in the "Pull Me Under"-Hamlet connection.  A coupla months back I
posted a small cross-reference, but apparently some people missed it so I've
posted a revised edition.  Those of you who read a.rnr.m.p and have already
read the post may want to bail out of this message now.  For those without
UseNet access, here's the cross-ref.  It contains only the blindingly obvious
connections really...  If you wanted to go into symbolism and esoteric
connections you could ramble for hours.

PULL ME UNDER
Images: Dream Theater
Words: Moore

Lost in the sky
Clouds roll by and I roll with them

	KING CLAUDIUS [to Hamlet]  How is it that the clouds still hang on you?

Arrows fly
Seas increase and then fall again

	HAMLET  To be, or not to be: that is the question:
		Whether 'tis nobler in the mind to suffer
		The slings and arrows of outrageous fortune,
		Or to take arms against a sea of troubles,
		And by opposing end them? To die: to sleep;
		No more; and by a sleep to say we end
		The heart-ache and the thousand natural shocks
		That flesh is heir to, 'tis a consummation
		Devoutly to be wish'd. To die, to sleep;
		To sleep: perchance to dream: ay, there's the rub;
		For in that sleep of death what dreams may come
		[and so on...]

This world is spinning around me
This world is spinning without me
Every day sends future to past
Every breath leaves one less to my last

Watch the sparrow falling
Gives new meaning to it all
If not today nor yet tomorrow then some other day

	HAMLET  Not a whit, we defy augury: there's a special
		providence in the fall of a sparrow. If it be now,
		'tis not to come; if it be not to come, it will be
		now; if it be not now, yet it will come: the
		readiness is all: since no man has aught of what he
		leaves, what is't to leave betimes?

I'll take seven lives for one

	There are seven deaths in Hamlet.

And then my only father's son
As sure as I did ever love him
I am not afraid

	Ghost   I am thy father's spirit,
		Doom'd for a certain term to walk the night,
		And for the day confined to fast in fires,
		Till the foul crimes done in my days of nature
		Are burnt and purged away. But that I am forbid
		To tell the secrets of my prison-house,
		I could a tale unfold whose lightest word
		Would harrow up thy soul, freeze thy young blood,
		Make thy two eyes, like stars, start from their spheres,
		Thy knotted and combined locks to part
		And each particular hair to stand on end,
		Like quills upon the fretful porpentine:
		But this eternal blazon must not be
		To ears of flesh and blood. List, list, O, list!
		If thou didst ever thy dear father love--

	HAMLET  O God!

	Ghost   Revenge his foul and most unnatural murder.

	HAMLET  Murder!

	Ghost   Murder most foul, as in the best it is;
		But this most foul, strange and unnatural.

	HAMLET  Haste me to know't, that I, with wings as swift
		As meditation or the thoughts of love,
		May sweep to my revenge.

			- AND -

	HAMLET	Ay, so, God be wi' ye;

		[Exeunt ROSENCRANTZ and GUILDENSTERN]

			Now I am alone.
				[...etc, etc...]
		O, vengeance!
		Why, what an ass am I! This is most brave,
		That I, the son of a dear father murder'd,
				[...etc, etc...]

This world is spinning around me
The whole world keeps spinning around me
All life is future to past
Every breath leaves me one less to my last

Pull me under  Pull me under
Pull me under  I'm not afraid
All that I feel in honor and spite
All I can do is set it right

	HAMLET  Rest, rest, perturbed spirit!

		[They swear]

				So, gentlemen,
		With all my love I do commend me to you:
		And what so poor a man as Hamlet is
		May do, to express his love and friending to you,
		God willing, shall not lack. Let us go in together;
		And still your fingers on your lips, I pray.
		The time is out of joint: O cursed spite,
		That ever I was born to set it right!

				- AND -

	HAMLET	[...]
		When honour's at the stake. How stand I then,
		That have a father kill'd, a mother stain'd,
		Excitements of my reason and my blood,
		And let all sleep? while, to my shame, I see
		The imminent death of twenty thousand men,
		That, for a fantasy and trick of fame,
		Go to their graves like beds, fight for a plot
		Whereon the numbers cannot try the cause,
		Which is not tomb enough and continent
		To hide the slain? O, from this time forth,
		My thoughts be bloody, or be nothing worth!

Dust fills my eyes
Clouds roll by and I roll with them
Centuries cry
Orders fly and I fall again

This world is spinning inside me
The whole world is spinning inside of me
Every day sends future to past
Every step brings me closer to my last

Pull me under  Pull me under
Pull me under  I'm not afraid
Living my life too much in in the sun
Only until your will is done

	HAMLET  Not so, my lord; I am too much i' the sun.
			[in response to Claudius's comment on clouds, above.]

Oh that this too
Too solid flesh
Would melt

	[Direct quote]

	HAMLET  O, that this too too solid flesh would melt
        Thaw and resolve itself into a dew!

===============================================-=============================
Pete "Ender" Walsh, AlterNet Junior Engineer   | Internet: email_address_removed
UUNet Technologies, Falls Church, VA.	       | UUCP: {anysite}!uunet!ender
===============================================-=============================
	"I'm picky.  Get it?!" - John Petrucci of Dream Theater

-- 
************************************************************************
* I was told there's a miricle for each day that I try                 *
* I was told there's a new love that's born for each one that has died *
* I was told there'd be no one to call on when I feel alone and afraid *
* I was told if you dream of the next world                            *
* You'll find yourself swimming in a lake of fire                      *
*	Dream Theater	Metropolis (part 1)	Images and Words       *
*	Michael Burstin			     Brandeis University       *
************************************************************************
*  Let's Go Pens   Let's Go Pens	 Lets Go Pens	 Let's Go Pens *
************************************************************************

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 6 Dec 1993 10:39:36 -0500 (EST)
From: email_address_removed (DAVID RE)
Subject: Re: re:YTSEJAM digest 254

>   I'm not really into heavy stuff.  Which is why I'm a big DT/Queencrych/
> Fates Warning fan. (BTW, I just ordered Night on Brocken by Fates Warning.
> Havn't gotten it in yet.  Any comments on it? :)

     DOn't have it :) Probably won't, either. The major prog head around here
is the lead singer in my band, but he doesn't have it either. :)

>   Do you think that X's 3rd album would suit me more then Gretchen?  Cos I
> guess I could tryto listen to another one... (what's 10 bucks? ;)

     $10??? Damn, where are you at?? I need to get a copy of Faith, and it's
more like $17 here in Atlanta :( Oh well. I'd say that you'd like either 
FHL or King's X. Faith has some stanger, more surealistic stuff on it,        
especially the song Faith, Hope, Love. Also has some pretty heavy stuff       
(although not *heavy* in the Metallica sense of the word), like Born to Be 
Loved. Hell, if it's only $10, go buy it, and if you don't like it, I'll 
but it from you :)

-- 
Dave Re                   |"I am your master, when you're all alone.
OIT/TS/ISD                | You can come to me child, when you're without home.
email_address_removed  | I will share your pain, of long lost dignity.
                          | Happiness evades you, you'll get no sympathy."
                          |       "Father of the Night", Crowdad
         "Heh Heh. I know where there's a dead raccoon!! Heh heh."
                       "FIRE!!!  FIRE!!! FIRE!!!"

 	 "The juggernaut that is Early Warning will CRUSH you!!!!" 

------------------------------

Date: Mon, 6 Dec 93 10:42:45 EST
From: email_address_removed (Michael A. Daugherty)
Subject: Re: YTSEJAM digest 260

	A couple of things:   

	I got my promo cd today! Wow! It wasn't a hoax. Thanks!

	Fates Warning: I have perfect symmetry and parallels.  Parallels is
awesome, but Symmetry is good too,  with Different Eyes being one of the best
progressive metal songs Ive ever heard.  Im wondering, is No exit any good? I
heard that would be the next best thing to get by them.  

-- 

------------------------------

Date:  Mon, 6 Dec 1993 11:06:00 +0000 
From: "oliver (o.r.) sampson" <[email-masked]>
Subject:  fw:YTSEJAM digest 42 

Here's a post from YTSEJAM #42 that shows the Pull Me Under/Hamlet connection.

**************************************************************************
Oliver Sampson                 "My opinions do not necessarily reflect 
Internet:  [email-masked]         those of my employer." 
**************************************************************************

---forwarded message---->

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 6 Apr 1993 05:47:59 -0400 (EDT)
From: email_address_removed (Pete "Ender" Walsh)
Subject: Pull Me Under / Hamlet

  Recent discussion on alt.rock-n-roll.metal.progressive has spawned renewed
interest in the "Pull Me Under"-Hamlet connection.  A coupla months back I
posted a small cross-reference, but apparently some people missed it so I've
posted a revised edition.  Those of you who read a.rnr.m.p and have already
read the post may want to bail out of this message now.  For those without
UseNet access, here's the cross-ref.  It contains only the blindingly obvious
connections really...  If you wanted to go into symbolism and esoteric
connections you could ramble for hours.

PULL ME UNDER
Images: Dream Theater
Words: Moore

Lost in the sky
Clouds roll by and I roll with them

	KING CLAUDIUS [to Hamlet]  How is it that the clouds still hang on you?

Arrows fly
Seas increase and then fall again

	HAMLET  To be, or not to be: that is the question:
		Whether 'tis nobler in the mind to suffer
		The slings and arrows of outrageous fortune,
		Or to take arms against a sea of troubles,
		And by opposing end them? To die: to sleep;
		No more; and by a sleep to say we end
		The heart-ache and the thousand natural shocks
		That flesh is heir to, 'tis a consummation
		Devoutly to be wish'd. To die, to sleep;
		To sleep: perchance to dream: ay, there's the rub;
		For in that sleep of death what dreams may come
		[and so on...]

This world is spinning around me
This world is spinning without me
Every day sends future to past
Every breath leaves one less to my last

Watch the sparrow falling
Gives new meaning to it all
If not today nor yet tomorrow then some other day

	HAMLET  Not a whit, we defy augury: there's a special
		providence in the fall of a sparrow. If it be now,
		'tis not to come; if it be not to come, it will be
		now; if it be not now, yet it will come: the
		readiness is all: since no man has aught of what he
		leaves, what is't to leave betimes?

I'll take seven lives for one

	There are seven deaths in Hamlet.

And then my only father's son
As sure as I did ever love him
I am not afraid

	Ghost   I am thy father's spirit,
		Doom'd for a certain term to walk the night,
		And for the day confined to fast in fires,
		Till the foul crimes done in my days of nature
		Are burnt and purged away. But that I am forbid
		To tell the secrets of my prison-house,
		I could a tale unfold whose lightest word
		Would harrow up thy soul, freeze thy young blood,
		Make thy two eyes, like stars, start from their spheres,
		Thy knotted and combined locks to part
		And each particular hair to stand on end,
		Like quills upon the fretful porpentine:
		But this eternal blazon must not be
		To ears of flesh and blood. List, list, O, list!
		If thou didst ever thy dear father love--

	HAMLET  O God!

	Ghost   Revenge his foul and most unnatural murder.

	HAMLET  Murder!

	Ghost   Murder most foul, as in the best it is;
		But this most foul, strange and unnatural.

	HAMLET  Haste me to know't, that I, with wings as swift
		As meditation or the thoughts of love,
		May sweep to my revenge.

			- AND -

	HAMLET	Ay, so, God be wi' ye;

		[Exeunt ROSENCRANTZ and GUILDENSTERN]

			Now I am alone.
				[...etc, etc...]
		O, vengeance!
		Why, what an ass am I! This is most brave,
		That I, the son of a dear father murder'd,
				[...etc, etc...]

This world is spinning around me
The whole world keeps spinning around me 
All life is future to past
Every breath leaves me one less to my last 

Pull me under  Pull me under
Pull me under  I'm not afraid
All that I feel in honor and spite
All I can do is set it right

	HAMLET  Rest, rest, perturbed spirit!

		[They swear]

				So, gentlemen,
		With all my love I do commend me to you:
		And what so poor a man as Hamlet is
		May do, to express his love and friending to you,
		God willing, shall not lack. Let us go in together;
		And still your fingers on your lips, I pray.
		The time is out of joint: O cursed spite,
		That ever I was born to set it right!

				- AND -

	HAMLET	[...]
		When honour's at the stake. How stand I then,
		That have a father kill'd, a mother stain'd,
		Excitements of my reason and my blood,
		And let all sleep? while, to my shame, I see
		The imminent death of twenty thousand men,
		That, for a fantasy and trick of fame,
		Go to their graves like beds, fight for a plot
		Whereon the numbers cannot try the cause,
		Which is not tomb enough and continent
		To hide the slain? O, from this time forth,
		My thoughts be bloody, or be nothing worth!

Dust fills my eyes
Clouds roll by and I roll with them
Centuries cry
Orders fly and I fall again

This world is spinning inside me
The whole world is spinning inside of me 
Every day sends future to past
Every step brings me closer to my last

Pull me under  Pull me under
Pull me under  I'm not afraid
Living my life too much in in the sun
Only until your will is done

	HAMLET  Not so, my lord; I am too much i' the sun.
			[in response to Claudius's comment on clouds, above.]

Oh that this too
Too solid flesh
Would melt

	[Direct quote]

	HAMLET  O, that this too too solid flesh would melt
        Thaw and resolve itself into a dew!

===============================================-=============================
Pete "Ender" Walsh, AlterNet Junior Engineer   | Internet: email_address_removed
UUNet Technologies, Falls Church, VA.	       | UUCP: {anysite}!uunet!ender
===============================================-=============================
	"I'm picky.  Get it?!" - John Petrucci of Dream Theater

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------------------------------
End of Digest
************************